Hugo Chavez calls using Twitter “terrorism”

January 27, 2010

For a man intent into taking Venezuelan into the Dark Ages, it was a remarkable admission that modernity can be a threat to Hugo Chavez and his fake revolution. As students used the Internet and its tools like Twitter as wel as other modern tools like SMS messaging to mobilize and communicate strategy instantly, Hugo Chavez made his second attack on the Internet in a single week, calling the rumors and use of this technology “terrorism”:

A week ago Chavez had said that his supporters had to watch out for the Internet and tonight he came on TV wearing a suit, rather than his usual red garb and began reading messages (which were too long to be from Twitter), calling it terrorism (right at the end, minute 3:50 or so)

Can Chavez really expect that his trusted friend and confidant resigns as Vice-President and Minister of Defense for “personal reasons” (and his wife as Minister of the Environment) and there will be no rumors?

Chavez repeated again his wish, which the opposition has paid absolutely no attention to, that to get rid of him his opponents had to call for a recall referendum, a tool that would not only be distracting, but quite difficult to achieve as the recall votes would have to exceed the number of votes he got in his Presidential reelection in 2006. (Chavez has made such a call four times in the last three weeks and seems frustrated by the lack of even a response) This would be difficult given the resources of the Government as well as the difficulty of mobilizing the voters at this time. The opposition wants to concentrate in the legislative elections in September, letting Chavez ride the harvest of his own incompetence until 2012 when his term expires.

The truth is that it is the Government has the weapons in this fight and is the one that has sponsored the violence against the students, who in turn have managed to use peaceful means to stop the violence like today at Government’s TV station VTV. But it was the Tupamaros who caused most of the violence in Merida, aided by the local law enforcement agencies. And it was Chavez who was seen mingling with Lina Ron in his Saturday rally, a woman that has led armed attacks on marches and was imprisoned in January 2009 for leading a violent attack against Globovision. Chavez can’t attack the opposition on the protests as the students have led the protests and do not respond to the political leaders of the opposition parties.

In the end it is ironic how Chavez evokes the fundamentalism of his Iranians buddies, who have also referred to the Internet and Twitter as terrorists, which is mocked in this hilarious cartoon below:

But in the end, besides feeling the threat from a weapon Chavez does not control or understand totally, maybe his key problem is that he could never make adequate use of it. For a man accustomed to uninterrupted speeches of six to eight hours, it must be simply impossible to even consider the possibility of communicating anything in 140 characters.

47 Responses to “Hugo Chavez calls using Twitter “terrorism””

  1. Robert Says:

    This call for a recall is a strange thing. Is this perhaps a test of the new gerrymandering with low risk for him? A way to gather info to influence September? I smell a rat.

  2. capitankane Says:

    so who is terrified exactly? I guess by Chavez logic it’s the pueblo.

  3. Gerry Says:

    If the Opposition do not call for a recall then, in Chavez logic, he has at least tacid concent he has a mandate.
    ***If you do not want to recall me then I must be doing my job.***

  4. island canuck Says:

    The recall offer is something that will not happen due to the problems with the famous Tascon list where even today people are prevented from working in government companies if they appear on this list.

    For anyone who doesn’t know what this list is it’s all the people that signed for a recall the last time.

    I have a feeling that now that the government has nationalized so many businesses that he would love a way to cull out those that he feels are the enemy. An easy way would be a new list of signers for a recall referendum.

    The opposition won’t fall for that carrot.

  5. moctavio Says:

    I think it annoys him that the oppo does not even respond to it.

  6. Floyd Looney Says:

    Then they should not respond to it. They should keep using Twitter too. Just because it drives him crazy.

  7. Matteo Says:

    “which were too long to be from Twitter”http://twitter.com/alexantosoro/statuses/8250154390
    ¿qué tal si averiguas?

  8. Alek Boyd Says:

    …For a man accustomed to uninterrupted speeches of six to eight hours, it must be simply impossible to even consider the possibility of communicating anything in 140 characters…

    Well put Miguel!

  9. JuanCristobal Says:

    There is a rumor that this is his account, managed by Izarrita

    http://www.twitter.com/HugoChavez_Vzla

  10. concerned Says:

    Chavez saw how the recall referendum worked for Evo, and he knows he has the CNE in his pocket so he can’t lose. It would only distract from the current issues and reinforce his position with the corrupt results from the polls.

    Don’t fall for it……….

  11. Karl Says:

    Nice clip from Merida. Police attacks residents in their own homes to stop Cacerolazo http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JxKAVK_nb8

  12. Alek Boyd Says:

    Bueno Juan, if that’s true, I would expect him to have millions of followers, not just over a thousand…

    Over the years, we have demonstrated beyond doubt that new technologies and internet is not chavismo’s forte. They just haven’t got a clue.

  13. Avila Says:

    Apple released their little tablet today. In demoing the new York times, see how everyone’s favorite strongman is on the front page:
    http://c0581892.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/apple-tablet-keynote_107.jpg

  14. Está Clarito Says:

    My god, you are insane! The title of this new is deeply wrong. I saw all the video, that is in spanish, and never hear to Chávez say “to use the twitter is terrorism”. That is a poor and tendencious interpretation from your fool head. Chávez say that “to use the twitter for send bad rumours and create anguish at people is terrorism”. That is so different and this idea is shared for many presidents of the world. Chávez never had been attack the Internet, on the contrary, he ask at her follows that use the net, but use only to do the good. For send true information. Please, clean your brain from so hate and bad emotions, because these lead at you to have a wrong perceptions of facts.

  15. moctavio Says:

    Then you did not listen to it.

  16. concerned Says:

    “That is a poor and tendencious interpretation from your fool head. Chávez say that “to use the twitter for send bad rumours and create anguish at people is terrorism”

    Please explain to me who exactly has the fool head here….Just another brainwashed clown that makes you wonder if it is not already too late to save this country.

  17. Juancho Says:

    Sra. Clarito no es claro. Su Inglés es atroz. Wrong site, chump. Move along . . .

    So far as the Chavistas not having any grasp of the net, that’s basically impossible. Most of the intelligence gathering done in Ven. is currently managed by Soviet-trained Cubans who are quite fluent with the internet. What’s more, there are legions of young folks working in the Chavez administration (lackies, it is true), and all of these folks grew up on the net.

    The problem, as usual, is not that El Presidente doesn’t have skill and know-how around him, rather, he just doesn’t utilize it, putting more currency on loyalty than efficiency. It’s Chavez himself who doesn’t understand the net, thereby he doesn’t trust it as something he can control, ergo the net is an “enemy” controlled by the “bourgeois.”

    BTW, have you seen the inside of Hugo’s private jet? Hardly campesino styling with those gold fixtures and so forth. Little of the old “pueblo” on board that baby.

    Then the lights went out . . .

    JL

  18. George Says:

    I can’t believe this person actaully dared to make this comment.

  19. Isa Says:

    Terrorism is Chávez on Alo Presidente saying his revolution is armed.

    Terrorism was Chávez in April 2002 with Plan Avila

    Terrorism was the shooters of Puente el LLaguno

    Terrorism is Lina Ron, who was seen buddy buddy with Chavez on saturday.

    Terrorists are La Piedrita and the Tupamaros.

    It is not terrorism to ask if something is true, to say you heard it, when there is a Government that lies. using your logic it was terrorism for Carrizales to resign and lie.

  20. Guillermo Andrade Says:

    Dear Sirs: I have been an avid follower of this site for several months now… and this thread looked so promising at first that I felt no need to say anything.
    After reading all the comments here I must sadly say that Chavez has been correct about everything regarding his strategy to hold power. No recalls, No Opossition, No People has, so far, risen to the level required for taking him out. There is also no need to do it, because the problem doesn’t lie in terms of the number of “lackeys” he might have at his disposal, or the mere fact that his political agenda is clearly following the Cuban example (in an even worse way), or rather based on the enormous economic misbalance created at the expense of public funds that have been systematically plundered by our president friends.
    So, Chavez was and is correct in doing what he is doing, in terms of keeping the powers lines (or as someone once said “the thin threads of power”), at his side, given that since the beginnings of his Reign, there hasn’t been a single valuable oppositionist up to the level of his intelligence.
    Sure! You may say that I’m being over-simplistic but hey, look at the examples:
    1. Venezuela is the ONLY country where its parties are SO STUPID, they think that democracy has been built in history with pacifist marches, demonstrations and declarations. And more to the point: the majority of the people still believe in that fallacy that equals a “democratic expression of will” ONLY to pacifist demonstrations and other stupid things like that. The hasn’t been ONE single example of ANY democracy, or even a simple change of a governance system, since the time of King Lipit-Ishtar, that did NOT involve a lot of blood, murder and a little chaos.
    2. Venezuelans are NOT willing to take out Chavez. In fact, every-time I go to the court building or walk around the streets, I find a great many similarities between President Chavez and the people that drive the public transport vehicles, the police, almost every civil servant (and the list goes on and on), DO represent some feature of Chavez. So, Venezuelans, despite everything, are still shrouded in the veil of their own apathy and egotistic nature (which are the two most prominent characteristics of Venezuelans since times immemorial). To comment on one example in this regard, allow me to use this premise: Most people say that “Oh Venezuelans are so nice… no bigotry and no racism there, all the people is friendly there no matter your race is…”. The sad truth is that such an statement is, simply, bullshit. There is some true over the fact that the signs of racism are really rare or extremely small, but that does not happen out of the supposed “kindness” of Venezuelans… it happens because Venezuelans DO NOT CARE about anything else that themselves individually, as in the saying that “everyman is for himself”, such is the real motivator in Venezuelans behavior. So please, try to have a more unbiased view of our own people and, for Christ’s sake do not tell me that such is not the case because you or your family might have friends of othere races. I am not dealing with those cases nor I am talking about “educated” “english-speaking” and “internet-savvy” venezuelans, which represent around 8% of the whole population.
    3. No matter what happens with the upcoming elections, sadly, Chavez is not going down. There is no sign of change within the people’s view of the country or their fellow countryman. In fact, most people just do not care.

    Hey!… at least we can still talk about it. ;-)

  21. Kepler Says:

    Juan, I don’t think it is Hugo’s account. Of if, the person who made him a friend of “Putin” is really silly. I checked out that “Putin” and the comments are hilarious…

    Guillermo,
    With other races? I wonder in what planet you are living, man.
    The vast majority of Venezuelans are very mixed, probably including you.
    That is one of the reasons why racism, although very present, is milder than in other places: most would be “escupiendo para arriba”.
    I have relatives who are very dark and others look very Asian (Indian) and others Scandinavian and so are most Venezuelans. That does not make us better but it does reduce a bit the level of racism. Of course there is a lot of racism on every side (mono this, mono that, raza pura, etc, etc).
    There are lots of other countries with delusion on racism, thinking in they are THE exception. It is OT, anyway.

    What I can say is that Venezuelans are particularly delusional on two things: 1) they think their country is rich, which is rubbish (Dagoberto wrote something nice on that in ccs) and 2) they really don’t know how bad the average education level (it is probably the worst of all Spanish American countries, definitely the worst by far in South America, Bolivia included)

    The only thing you got right is that most people in Venezuela don’t have Internet access or speak English or are well educated.

    The oppo is surely making errors. This is the time not just to nag, but to come up with clear proposals, not playing just the cassandra.

    History? WE need to learn from history?
    A little bit of world history should help YOU, starting with a bit about our neighbours to the West. Ts, ts…
    We want to avoid a civil war. Actually, I believe the most likely scenario now is some sort of long low-flame civil war. Still, I think with some group of intelligent people (not leaders) it is possible to do some useful demining work and minimize losses.

    You never heard of the Velvet Revolution (I had friends taking part in it)? India and Gandhi? (a good book with lots of the thoughts not just of Gandhi but other leaders is Life of Mahatma Gandhi, by Fischer).

    Lots of radical changes in Sweden, Norway…hell, even in
    very closed and empoverished and illiterate Portugal!

    YOU really need some history. A tip: start with From Fire to Freund by Peter Watson. It presumes the reader has a little bit of knowledge of general world history, but you can use Wikipedia these days or an old text book from secondary school.

    There is more to history than the US, the French Revolution and the best known stories from the Fertile crescent.
    Actually: a lot of it would tell us that even if the danger for total collapse is huge, there is a lot we can and should do to – I will use the word again – demine the fields.

  22. NicaCat Says:

    This is a little OT, but does deal with technology involving Chávez – IN NICARAGUA!!!!
    http://knightcenter.utexas.edu/blog/?q=en/node/6309

  23. Juancho Says:

    So far as the mixed race thing goes in Ven., I think my family is somewhat typical. I’m 7/8 Irish and 1/8 Comanche Indian. My wife is from Anzoátegui and is morena. One kid looks like a California sufer and the other, an Italian. I have a brother in law that’s dark as a tire and tias and tios and so forth running from trigano to con leche to blanquita to negrote, all within the same familia. If any one from this group gives a shit about what tone they are, it’s news to me. And when you look at who has married who in terms of skin color, it’s all over the map, with no pattern that I can tell.

    While I agree somewhat with Guillermo Andrade that here in Venezuela, apathy and self-centeredness rules, the level of education is rising fast and the younger generation is much, much more international and hip than kids from just 15 years ago. That much said, we are still all speaking in a vacuum here on this and other sites because as Kepler and others point out, the vast majority of Venezuelans are pretty insular, are not multilingual, and don’t have the international exposure of people on this and other blogs, and so wouldn’t appreciate the context from which many of the posts are coming from. For many of us, it is important to simply state the known facts or at least approximate the truth just to stay sane, given that here, the degree of mininformation, spin, and outright bullshit is so legion to be crazy making. I also think there’s a great need to try and keep some semi-objective running record/commentary of what is, in a tragicomic kind of way, one of the greatest shows on earth: The Hugo Chavez Big Top. He might blast Globovision and others off the air but I swear his administration was fashioned by the same hacks writing those corny novelas. From the red shirts to the Gringo earthquake machine to the Jews gutting the Bolivar to the seven hour speeches/harangues, current day Venezuelan politics are right out of Sabado Sensational.

    Judging by the murder rate in Venezuela, endemic violence is a possibility. Let’s hope, however, that passaive and intelligent resistence wins in the end.

    Juancho

  24. Guillermo Andrade Says:

    Dear Kepler:
    1. “With other races? I wonder in what planet you are living, man.” Apparently NOT in yours.
    2. “Of course there is a lot of racism on every side (mono this, mono that, raza pura, etc, etc).” That’s part of the point I was trying to make.
    3. “History? WE need to learn from history?” Yes indeed. The basic societal problems have not changed much since the 19th Century B.C. Nor have the basic mechanisms that make political and structural changes possible in any organized population within a defined territory.
    4. “You never heard of the Velvet Revolution?” Ohh yes. It was a modern version of the same “Guerra de Independencia” that venezuelans are so proud of. Let me explain:
    1. The success (if I may use a wrong word for it) of the so called “velvet revolution” was a direct consequence of a myriad of EXTERNAL factors, among which the perestroika was paramount. I leave to you the task of learning why. The fall of the communist party in Czechoslovakia was bound to happen sooner or later due to the generalized weakening processes happening in other countries that affected many structures of the government of that country at the time…
    Similarly, the so called efforts of great “Venezuelan heroes” were just as appropriately timed as it was the fall and incapacitation of the Spanish Reign to support and hold enough power of its foreign domains during the XIX century all around the world. If Bolivar or Sucre have not been born, we would “achieve” the independent status anyway…and someone surely would have taken the credit for it. Venezuela’s history is overrated.
    The lesson here is that when you are fighting against an already weakened and incapacitated enemy the question is: is it really your victory?
    2. You cite Gandhi? In only three or four years Gandhi’s revolution caused more deaths than the whole number of deaths accumulated in Venezuela during the last 50 years caused by political reasons. So? What’s your point? THat it is possible to fight for democracy without spilling blood? Come on man! We humans haven’t changed a bit since the 19th century B.C., How can you expect that such a low educated population of a third world country as Venezuela might have what it takes to reinvent the wheel in term of political maturity?.
    You cling yourself, as most middle class venezuelans, on the false notion that you know more that every other society, and thus, can set a supposed exemplary behavior to everyone else. In the mean time everybody is still taking in he same crap the so called “political opposition leaders” give in: “Let’s march… let’s talk, let them see”
    3. “Lots of radical changes in Sweden, Norway…” Come on! You still think you or we can even compare to two of the most educated, advanced and literate societies in the world? We are, by a fair comparison, a bunch of brutes man. They average around 3 to 7 violent deaths a year. They have probably the most advanced telecommunications infrastructure of the planet.

    There is no SINGLE example in our recorded history of ANY significant change in the structure of power that haven’t been preceded by a river of blood. At any rate, we are just being too comfy trying to obtain something that is just impossible with words. It takes guts to forge democracy… not bullshit.

    BTW: I know not much of history, but I’d like you to try to see things in perspective. Not everything is bad, but certainly: not everything, especially the valuable things, can be obtained just by wit or nice words. That is the lesson of history… not me.

  25. Bill Simpson of Slidell USA Says:

    As long as he can buy votes using oil money, and influence the uneducated through control of the mass media, he can remain in power. Bush was elected to a second term, even after he invaded a country, Iraq, which had nothing to do with the 9/11 terrorist attacks, because, early on, the TV constantly reported that Saddam Hussein was involved with al Qaeda. Not one piece of evidence was ever produced to support the false claim. The media cheer-led an illegal war, and convinced the American people that it was legal self defense. Most Americans STILL believe the lie. TV is the ultimate brainwashing machine for politicians to use on the ignorant masses. It will take many years, if ever, for the Internet users to be able to counter it.

  26. Kepler Says:

    Guillermo,

    About 91% of all Venezuelans have European-Middle-East-origin male haplogroups. About 7% hav sub-Saharan, i.e. black haplogroups on the male side. The tiny rest have native American male haplogroups.
    About 65% of Venezuelans have native American female haplogroups.
    Then comes European and sub-Saharan.

    There was an interesting study about haplogroups and autosomal markers in the capital and the results were fascinating, even if they were expected: the female part was more Indian and African in the public maternities than in the private ones, even if the mix was everywhere, but on the paternal side the contribution was vastly European on both sides. It is clear: the darker you get, the more likely you are to be poor in Venezuela. Still: we hardly can talk about races when most people are “mongrels”. We can talk at most about some very fuzzy clusters.

    The big problem is the identity problem Venezuelans have. As RomRod said: tenemos un pasticho histórico (historical lasagna? refering to the mess we have in our minds about basic world history and how Venezuelans really came about). One example: a chavista who was writing we should not give money to El Sistema
    but instead focus on the African drums that were our real heritage blablabla and that his ancestors were enslaved by “OUR” ancestors.
    I looked at his picture and I saw he looked as white as I do.
    On the other side you have those permanently nagging about our “Indian genes” and “lo indio que somos” without knowledge of a lot of important historical conditions (Jared Diamond’s book or even video on youtube on “Germs, Guns and Steel” makes for interesting reading on this topic)

    We have a big big big issue: education. The divide between the education level in poor and rich sectors is particularly big in Venezuela. I have written a lot about this.

    On the czech Republic: there was also Romania (I don’t mention Jugoslavia because there were ethnic issues there all the time).
    I already mentioned Portugal. Albania’s change was much more pacific than Romania’s.

    India is the second most populated nation on Earth.

    My point is that it is an open game. Education is not in our genes.
    There is more than simple education by going to school.

    Your point seems to be
    “there has to be violence”, “something will happen”

    Obviously something will happen. There has to be violence? There will be violence? can you elaborate? There are more than 14000 murders every year in Venezuela now.

    I agree it is stupid if people just march, march, march, specially if it is the people in the capital, who seem to be forgetting the rest of the country as usual.

  27. Guillermo Andrade Says:

    Dear Kepler: You are partially correct when you said that one of my points was that “there has to be violence”… in regard of the expression “something will happen” I have to say no… nothing will happen.
    The problem with violence is that it cannot be taken as a single-dimension variable with a single linear output: i.e. “As there are many “malandros” out on the streets there should be a proportional number of murders and robberies of all kinds”. Such incorrect assessments are proof of an oversimplified approach to violence that lead to horribly incorrect conclusions.
    Violence is physically hard-wired into our DNA. Since we are advanced primates, violence is a typical chain reaction that can be traced within the sub-cellular level. Now, the social interactions we have had all throughout our history as humans, have been interpreted in many, many ways, since the times of the Ceasars, we’ve had innumerable approaches to the basic problem of interdependency, resources distribution and the exercise of power and order. Over these, we could discuss endlessly.
    However, and speaking objectively, there hasn’t been a single exception to the rule of violence in any human community whenever the structures of power have changed either for the worse or the betterment of any population.
    What I’m trying to support is not a position of tragic outcome for this country, but rather one of understanding: There will be no change until venezuelans two most notable traits (namely self-centeredness and egotism) change and disappear by virtue of such grand and traumatic event that can affect at least half of our current population. There is no other solution, nor we have the luxury of wasting our valuable time in marches or meaningless demonstrations, because the vast majority of population do really support Chavez and, they share similar traits with him.
    This identification by example of conduct has been proved rather impossible to remove from any given society throughout recent history , thus, its pointless and obviously wrong, to waste your time to even listening to your favorite opposition leader, since all of them are still quite at loss in defining what they have simply called as the “chavez effect” or something like that. After 10 years, they have no clue about anything we have discussed here. So why would I waste my vote or my time on such a person.?

    So violence rather than be observed as a measurable cause of social strife, unhappiness and many other ugly things in life, can also be considered an effect of individual and grupal causalities that, so far, none of the venezuelan politicians have dare to talk about. They just don’t care as the rest of the people. There is also the problem with social stratification and speciation that have been ocurring and accelerating thanks to Chavez, both of which have not been account for by the opossition.
    So Kepler, have you read a novel titled ¨1984¨? We are going there man. Venezuelans just don’t have what it takes.

  28. Guillermo Andrade Says:

    Ohh… I forgot… the answer to your question is that I think the problem is not the there has to be violence (I have already told you that such outcome is inevitable). The problem is that in Venezuela, there are no signs of the level and type of violence required to create the social and power changes necessary.

  29. concerned Says:

    Guillermo Andrade,

    So if what you are saying is correct, the fundamental tendancies of Chavismo trace back to the sub cellular level or within the DNA chain. If this is the case, the condition could be treated through meds. As the condition is widespread to almost epidemic proportions, I lean more toward some sort of viral outbreak which could be cured if the gene could be extracted from the host. If we could get a blood sample from Hugo to the proper laboratory, a cure could be formulated and dispensed through a vaccination program or possibly through an airdrop over Miraflores. It could be even more sinister than that with the people being intentially inoculated with a Cuban formulated agent through the Barrio Adentro facilities.

  30. Kepler Says:

    Guillermo,

    Why would you waste your vote? Well, because the level of destruction would be lower.

    We have seen how the country has gone down the drain in the past 11 years. As far as I can remember I was dissatisfied with the governments in power, but that does not mean I think the situation is hopeless. By NOT voting and not trying to calculate what is the least evil, you are becoming a big part of the problem.

    Politicians are just “some of us”, it is always like that. It depends thus on us to choose and make better politicians. I wish we had some politicians like Germany in the XIX century, Sweden or Norway in the XVIII, the US in the XVIII, etc.
    We don’t have that.
    Instead, I have written since the early nineties to a couple of
    politicians and put forward some ideas.
    Perhaps some of the ideas are rubbish, but perhaps some help.

    There is one on education that was implemented in an oppo region and that is something. Juan knows about it but I can’t go into it YET.

    There was another that
    was implemented in Valencia, although I don’t know
    if it was because of my writing, the idea was very self-evident…but the politician in question wrote me back (it was Salas-Römer and I am not a fan of the PV thing)

    Everything can change, depending on us ALL. Politicians, even very bad ones, pay attention to us unless they are absolutely mad, as Hugo is.

  31. firepigette Says:

    A little clarification on Kepler’s Gandhi:

    Gandhi once said something useful:

    “Honest disagreement is often a good sign of progress.”

    The popular image of Gandhi is extremely misleading. Gandhi’s ideology was in fact rooted in racial animosity; first against the blacks in South Africa and later against the whites in India.The very nature of the Hindu belief in Karma is the foundation of the belief in the Castes- the belief that we are paying for past mistakes and deserve our lot.Remember, Gandhi was a Hindu, wherever his political persuasion led him.

    Gandhi didn’t preach revolt against all those who oppress the poor. He wanted to teach them instead to get a little more out of what they already had,and to earn something in the dry season by hand-labor, even though it was very little; because they hadn’t another choice.

    He was a political promulgator of passive – aggressive tactics….while simultaneously supporting the traditional caste system.This is not, and never should be construed as non violent, yet it is used by Western political manipulators to mean so.

    Passive aggressive should hardly be called non violent.It is violence against the soul and definitely a coercion.

    Gandhi’s attitude towards the Indian structured system ( caste system) of inequality was at best ambivalent. . The caste system was, and remains. a power base where exclusiveness and privilege of birth ensured the best for the twice-born.

    Perhaps one day the world will evolve into a truly non violent place , but until then, those who do not channel violence for legitimate self defense will lose to those who DO use violence as a way of life.Example: Venezuela.

    And :
    Guillermo is correct.It is in our DNA.It will surface either in passive or undirected forms( accepting the unacceptable (self violence), or random violence on the streets),

    or it will win unjust and unholy wars.

    One thing is to have non violence as an ultimate goal and to practice a certain degree of pacifism in some circumstances, and another is to pretend to live in a non violent world( fantasy).

  32. Kepler Says:

    Firepigette, where did you get your knowledge of Gandhi? And history at all?
    Where do you get your information? From your local White Supremacist school?

    “It is in our DNA.”
    No comments.

  33. firepigette Says:

    Kepler, Learn to read.I did not say it is in only white’s DNA..It is in all sentient beings DNA.Violence is part of the reptilian brain..you need to study biology.

    As for Gandhi, you need to study more on the Hindu religion, the meaning of Karma, and the role it plays in Indian politics.

    As a practitioner of the Caste system, Gandhi( by definition) was a racist.

  34. Kepler Says:

    Firepigette,
    I think you are the last person to tell others about biology or history, for that matter. You really construct your little world from a very limited set of pieces of information about the outside world and a lot of prejudices most people have overcome for over half a century.

    I do not see Gandhi as a saint or in the way you see all your New Age idols. But I have to say you have no idea what Gandhi did. And this is, as I said, beyond him. It was a whole movement with ideas. But then you like to talk without having the slightest clue about the whole issue but “He was Hindu”.
    I suppose you will run now to look for some arguments with some quick googling, as you did when I mentioned something from Jared Diamond…

    End of conversation with you. Go see if your cookies are baked.

  35. deananash Says:

    The BIG picture here isn’t about race, folks, but rather who controls the means of communication. The nationalization of CANTV is (finally) making more and more sense to the ignorant masses. It was never about providing the country with something better, it was always about control.

    Chavez can simply order the plug pulled. Look for all remaining telecoms to be nationalized, perhaps without compensation, a la RCTV.

  36. firepigette Says:

    kEPLER,

    Ad homimen…as usual you have no points except personal attacks:By the way I detest NEW Age anything …so your little attack is actually humorous Look up reptilian brain Kep.

    Deananash,

    You are right.This IS not about race in any direct way.I exposed Kepler’s mention of Gandhi because he always brings him up in the context of the opposition in order to disqualify it.

    Never mind that Gandhi was confronting a democracy that was already debating whether to withdraw from India,in contrast to DICTATORIAL Chavez who would like to do exactly the opposite:keep Venezuela and expand all over LA.

  37. Guillermo Andrade Says:

    Chavez will rule as long as venezuelans keep being like they are now: illiterate, lazy, egotistic and self-centered. As long as any citizen you find in any street at any day (and I don’t mean your neighbor but a taxi driver or a simple pedestrian), keeps behaving as a “vivo” or “más vivo que el otro”, we will extend this situation into an endless cyclic pattern. Chavez is not the problem… is the necessary effect of a degraded population, where, i.e. at least 70% of teachers at all levels of education suffer from some type of psicopathy, and at least 90% of the whole teaching strata comes from the D level of our “society”.

    Chavez is just capitalizing in what’s already inside most venezuelans.
    BTW: I’m not implying that there’s no hope to this situation. I’m just saying that having hope as such is completely inmaterial in terms of finding a “nice democratic solution”.

    There’s an old saying: When the shit hits the fan, that’s when you know you have to run….
    Well, we didn’t and now are deeply surrounded by it. We just have to wait until this society can achieve a certain level of conditioning in order to begin our release… :-)

  38. Guillermo Andrade Says:

    Dear Kepler: You said “We have seen how the country has gone down the drain in the past 11 year”… I do disagree.
    No country has ever gone down the drain. That’s bullshit coming from the media and the opposition. Never in modern history has any country faced an utterly level of destruction such as the one implied by your statement. Not even Polony, which BTW, has the all-time record in recorded inflation (after WWII) has gone down the drain.
    As I said, it’s just a dramatic statement created only to scare children and little people. Please pay no heed to it.

  39. Kepler Says:

    Guillermo, it depends what you understand by going down the drain. That simply means that the situation deteriorates so dramatically that it will take decades to get the country on the road to development. We were doing badly before that, of course. chavismo is just the consequence of it: of the widespread ignorance, the corruption, the parasitic relationship with oil.

    Still: education for the poor is worse than ever. When most of your teachers are actually incapable of the most basic reasoning, when they hate reading (no, this goes beyond salary), when they know not what quality control is, you are in trouble. Venezuela stopped taking part in open evaluation of its education in 1998.

    When drug consumption increases in the way it has increased in Venezuela as it has done in the last 20 years and nothing is done, you have a pressure cooker.

    When you have that Venezuela has the highest birth rate in South America (apart from French Guyana, I think) and it just depends on oil and the world can experience an energy shift during this generation, you have the potential for disaster.

    I said it several times here: Hugo is just lethal TB, Venezuela has sociocultural AIDS. We need to tackle both, as doctors do.

    I did not buy the crap about chavismo taking away children or Venezuela becoming communist. It is now a dictatorship, though. And that we did not have for a long time.

  40. Kepler Says:

    Never in modern history?
    Actually: plenty. Afghanistan is one. Kambodia was another one. It is recovering after many years.
    Haiti has been doing it for 200 years already. Several African countries have as well, like Somalia and before Uganda (although not as badly)

  41. espadachin Says:

    Nothing more need be said:

  42. Juancho Says:

    Chavismo can largely be seen as a natural power shift from los ricos (pocos) to los campesinos (muchos), from the haves, to the have-nots. It didn’t work out as planned or as hoped for, but there can be no doubt that power is now widely wielded by many who just a decade ago were basically powerless owing to socio-economic position near the bottom of the food chain. Tragically, the lower class is arguably worse off now (manos a little health care in el pueblos). The problem is that vital institutions (power, communications, water, etc.) were given over to the former have-nots, who unfortunately have-not the wherewithal, judgment, discipline, and know-how to maintain services, and now, predictably, we see those institutions starting to crumble. Every thinking person in every country on earth knows that the larger part of Chavez’ legendary speeches is theater, narcissistic posturing, and political grandstanding, all lardered with the most fatuous bullshit. But those aforementioned institutions could not run on bullshit alone – and so now the lights are going out and the water is off half the time. Que lastima, indeed.

    It is argued on this and many other sites that Chavez and the Bolo Revolution cannot be corrected, that a coherent opposition cannot be fashioned till the psychological profile of the “average” Venezuelan undergoes a major makeover. Many on this site think violence is the only catalyst for such radical and much needed change. Perhaps the hardships just ahead – resulting from the total collapse of all our institutions and basic services – will provide the required impetus, and we can avoid the blood bath.

    Por seguro – some basic and indismissible shock (what they call a “bottom” in the recovery movement) is probably needed for a cultural transformation to ever occur, and for real and lasting change to sweep the land like wildfire.

    Junacho

  43. moctavio Says:

    Actually Juancho heath care is worse under Chavez according to studies. The only thing that has improved is a slightly better purchasing power by the poorer, which is much less that in teh past given all the money that came in, but all other indicators of quality of life have disappeared, Iw ould bet the purchasing power will soon be worse thanks to the devaluation.

  44. Juancho Says:

    Moctavio wrote: “Actually Juancho heath care is worse under Chavez according to studies.”

    I was willing to give Chavez the benefit of the doubt on this one, first, because I know that there are thousands of Cubano nurses posing as doctors here in Venezuela, but at least some increase in health care professionals is evident over the past decade; and two, there actually have been clinics set up in pueblos that were not there ten years ago.

    But the public sector medical field is quite grim. And the following story is an absolute fact that I can vouchsafe from direct experience.

    A neighbor is a medical student who works in the state hospital (location undisclosed). The air conditioner broke down in the morgue and the administrator simply couldn’t get it together to fix it. There are huge signs posted in front of the hospital with giant pics of Hugo and smiling babies and all that basura. Meanwhile corpses are festering in the morgue, with the bodies stacking up so high that some had to be placed in chairs. When it came time to burry those in the chairs rigor mortis had already set in owing to the lack of air conditioning, and the bodies had to be “broken down” to fit into the caskets.

    The air conditioner broke down over a year ago. It’s still busted.

    No shit.

    Juancho


  45. [...] Chavez says Twitter = Terrorism [...]


  46. [...] whole thing is not new, I have reported about this fact and this evidence a few times, here, here and here, but just want to add to the clear evidence that the Venezuelan Government under [...]

  47. Iraq Says:

    Segun esta web Michel de Nostradamus ya adelantaba esta situacion en Iraq


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